XSeries-forum

I should have known better and gone to my Indy but it was a spur of the moment thing....that I deeply regret.

Went to a place in Denton that had the Hunter machine, quite swanky and did insurance repairs too.

Car was eating an outer edge of the left rear so I thought lets get it "huntered"....I've seen the adjustment bits so it cant be too much of a problem.....WRONG

30 mins after it was wheeled round the corner the shop manager  came in and said they'd had a problem. They'd only gone and sheared off the inner cam bolt on the right rear wishbone. I'm like WTF......"well we did use penetrating fluid on it".  Did you try heating up the nut? No.....WTF....I came in for and adjustment and my car is now undriveable.............FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

Well we could get a new bolt but it would be tommorow....WHAT....the BMW dealer is still open...GO GET ONE.
Bit of procrastination
The bolt seems corroded in so it might need a new wishbone too...........WTF ....this is a joke
Well it would need a new wishbone after we DRILL It out......DRILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!........FFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFFF

This often happens with OLD CARS (54 plate by the way)

Now it seems I'm dealing with cowboys who just throw new parts at cars

I can't afford to be off the road...what do you suggest....Well we can WELD the Cam and nut on so you can take it to your INDY................and that's safe HOW??

I said...Tack it on....Throw it on a TRAILER....take me to my INDY

...and that's where it is now until Tuesday

Indy looked at it and was WTF....I've never seen a bolt that big under there sheared off. Wagon driver rolled his eyes....said it all really

It still needs tracking and a £13 bolt

Denton.......................WIDE BERTH Folks


...ohh....and the receptionist was non too kindly with her words after the phone went down on some customers....did she not know I was listening?

Sorry to hear the bad news about your X5'

It's a pain but at least at your regular Indy it will get sorted.

[quote="graemeX5"]
Sorry to hear the bad news about your X5'

It's a pain but at least at your regular Indy it will get sorted.
[/quote]

I hope so....I wasn't impressed at the "old car" jibe. True these nuts were on since new but it beggars belief how much torque they'd put in to rip the head off. At the very least they didn't have the nerve to charge me for the work done or the trailer to some 4 miles. Annoyingly but uderstandable they wrote a letter of "unsafe" to cover their backsides if I drove it in that condition. I wouldn't have done as we're talking the risk of rear suspension collapse or dislocation

The trailer was offered up very easily...perhaps the pangs of guilt in being so ham fisted. The amount of shop on lookers was amazing too. Was this unusual or was someone in deep sh!t...who knows

Does make you wonder where the line is drawn on poor technique or parts not in a fit state to be disassembled. If my indy suggests he's never seen a bolt like that sheared then I supsect the former. This sort of thing could happen anytime dependant on who's weilding the spanners but I don't recall any sort of indeminity beforehand

How do you prove such a thing unless there's a 6 foot wrench lying about. Gut feeling says anything longer than 1.5 foot is beyond the force needed to slacken the joint

I hope this wont cost more than a bolt and some labour grunt.

http://www.realoem.com/bmw/showparts.do ... g=33&fg=30

Part 18 is what's broke as the nut (part 20) was spun clean off

Are they not paying for it to be fixed then??  Right cowboys,!!

Unfortunately seized fastenings are common on cars........especially older ones that have done a few winters.

Many cars out there with worn suspension parts and/or that haven't been aligned for years.

It is plain reality that fastenings can corrode & sometimes shear when attempts made to free/remove.......... I have 3 cars on drive with circa 350k miles between them so speak with some experience.

I had a fitter shear/snap an E36 track rod end shear on a Hunter adjustment.. they paid for that but the same shop now refuses to proceed further if they come against a seized fastening/adjuster.

Someone using experience, care and correct tools to deal with fastening seizures a bonus but sometimes shearing or need to drill out cannot be easily avoided.


Penetration oil & heat can be useful but sometimes fastenings are simply too corroded for damage free removal. Another issue to consider the heat is that in some situations hat can transfer to and damage rubber bushes etc.

Not making excuses for situations where cars are treated brutally or handled by the ignorant.

[quote="Jamee"]
Are they not paying for it to be fixed then??  Right cowboys,!!
[/quote]

They never offered...I as yet have not asked. If I get the car back tommorow we'll see just what it took and I'll go from there. I think they panicked and were warning that more bolts may shear in their attempt to fix this problem. I wasn't convinced of their methods or repair....it could have gone on and on and on...so I took it off them before it went worse

[quote="AW8"]
Unfortunately seized fastenings are common on cars........especially older ones that have done a few winters.

Many cars out there with worn suspension parts and/or that haven't been aligned for years.

It is plain reality that fastenings can corrode & sometimes shear when attempts made to free/remove.......... I have 3 cars on drive with circa 350k miles between them so speak with some experience.

I had a fitter shear/snap an E36 track rod end shear on a Hunter adjustment.. they paid for that but the same shop now refuses to proceed further if they come against a seized fastening/adjuster.

Someone using experience, care and correct tools to deal with fastening seizures a bonus but sometimes shearing or need to drill out cannot be easily avoided.


Penetration oil & heat can be useful but sometimes fastenings are simply too corroded for damage free removal. Another issue to consider the heat is that in some situations hat can transfer to and damage rubber bushes etc.

Not making excuses for situations where cars are treated brutally or handled by the ignorant.
[/quote]

I hear what you're saying but the amount of force needed must have beyond what was normal.....this wasn't me with a piece of scaffolding.

The peculiar bit I guess is indeminity for this kind of situationon both sides. If it could happen should they have warned of the consequences and or culpability?

The only cost mention was that the bolt was about £13...no other money was mentioned but they then did warn that the repair work might cause more breakages.....which is where the "job" ended

this is very common, and really I have cars that age but realistically  a 54 car is old now so this will happen, heat isn't a miracle, its very bad on some of the suspension where alloy parts and steel parts are together they react with each other.

[quote="shadrack"]
this is very common, and really I have cars that age but realistically  a 54 car is old now so this will happen, heat isn't a miracle, its very bad on some of the suspension where alloy parts and steel parts are together they react with each other.
[/quote]

There may be a bit of the galvanic corrosion going on....from what I saw. But the NUT and the eccentric washer were loose....after it fell on the floor. The only corrosion I can think of is the bolt in the bush, not against the arm.

The issues as I saw (pehaps written a little in hindsight) is that just when do you give up and know that it's not going to budge? I've done it myself on small bolts but this wasn't that small and a supposedly pro garage. If my indy says he's never seen that bolt ripped off then I believe him.

Now if they'd have come to me beforehand and said things may get broken "because it's an old car" then it may or may not have changed the outcome. The "old car" was wheeled out after the nut was on the floor

I'm never going to get to the bottom of this but perhaps it's a cautionary tale for others considering having this work done as the impact is HUGE. The car is off the road...period...and if it's happened either on your drive or at a place where you don't normally do business then you may not be as "lucky" as me to get it flat backed elsewhere.

The outcome as they say will be tommorow if the indy's Fixed it.

Sounds like an absolute nightmare! Keep us updated on your progress.

I'd be pressing the incompetent idiots in Denton to help with any additional Indy costs here though...  >:D

If the bolt was siezed in the bush, they would have had to knock the remainder out with a drift. As you have realised your observation about the nut and eccentric washer being loose disproves this.

I have taken the complete rear suspension apart on my old E53 and this particular fixing came out nice and easy. You are right- you will never know how it happened.

Hope it gets sorted without too much hassle.

As a side I always douse all adjustment points with WD-40 or similar a couple of days before wheel alignment as a 'just in case'.

[quote="Black X5"]
If the bolt was siezed in the bush, they would have had to knock the remainder out with a drift. As you have realised your observation about the nut and eccentric washer being loose disproves this.

I have taken the complete rear suspension apart on my old E53 and this particular fixing came out nice and easy. You are right- you will never know how it happened.

Hope it gets sorted without too much hassle.

As a side I always douse all adjustment points with WD-40 or similar a couple of days before wheel alignment as a 'just in case'.
[/quote]

I'm not sure about this at all and that's what fascinates me.

The NUT at the rear of the car was what sheared off, something stopped the nut rotating on the thread, the washer coming off was probably after the tension had gone so the washer can't have been at fault.

Nut rusted to bolt and/or bolt siezed in bush   ...probably the former

For reasons I've not yet discovered is why when a bolt was sourceable did they not even try drifting it out? The word DRILL set off the alarm bells and much wallet emptying....not to mention the reticence to go get a replacement bolt annoyed me as the dealer was only 5 miles away.


Good call on the WD40 though....shed loads of it

Exactly!

Did you see the 2 pieces of the sheared fixing? Possible exposed thread of bolt past the nut was damaged, thus locking the nut onto the bolt.

Maybe by an over zealous attempt to free an adjacent component with a 'sledge hammer' missing the intended target and damaging the exposed part of the bolt.  The amount of damage I have seen on cars unrelated to but caused by removal/refit of a faulty component is unreal (this includes brand new cars still at the factory!)

[quote="Black X5"]
Exactly!

Did you see the 2 pieces of the sheared fixing? Possible exposed thread of bolt past the nut was damaged, thus locking the nut onto the bolt.

Maybe by an over zealous attempt to free an adjacent component with a 'sledge hammer' missing the intended target and damaging the exposed part of the bolt.  The amount of damage I have seen on cars unrelated to but caused by removal/refit of a faulty component is unreal (this includes brand new cars still at the factory!)
[/quote]

Car isn't back yet....2 attempts later it appears BMW have only just supplied the right bolt, nut and washer. I can't moan because I did drop it unannounced and the indy is bailing me out of someone elses handywork. Seeing as I didn't realise they had tracking equipment and I went elsewhere I can't blame them for not rushing but at least it will be right.

Will have to take the wife's X5 to work instead....but I miss my car

As for the nut....it disappeared, all that was on show was the sheared end of the bolt poking out about the thickness of the washer. I know it was a washer thickness because they tack welded the washer onto it..the stub of the bolt that is.

That is really bad. I've removed all the bolts, nuts, bushes, etc from 2 "OLDER X5's" now whilst moving them to coilovers and adjustable camber bushes (my own and a fellow forum member) and that's in my garage sat/lying on the floor with standard'ish tools no problems at all (even when they have appeared to be seized) so this does really surprise me to no end.