X5 Concept eDrive

[Benstan]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/motoring/car ... eiled.html

New X5 hybrid - 75 mpg and 90g Co2/km with ability to do 19miles on electric power.

This looks pretty good to me - weekdays my X5 does a couple of school runs and local trips, so electric power for those would be useful.  It's only at weekends that it stretches its legs and those miles are at the most economical speeds.

Cost will determine the popularity I suspect.

Talking of fuel economy...just got back from the US.  Hired a midsize saloon and given an Infiniti G37.  A V6 3.7litre engine in a car the size of a 3 series.  Did 22mpg but cost $59 (£40) to fill up tank.  Nice drive but unthinkable in the UK.

[X5Sport]

19 miles on electric only?  I can't even get to work with that, and it will probably need a separate 150A supply into the house to charge it in a reasonable time which will then cost a fortune in electricity and still produce the same overall carbon footprint as a 3.0D does with no washing machine motor and half a tonne battery pack.

I know it's a 'hybrid' but come on, this may allow celebrities to have better 'green credentials' with the papa-rats - sorry paparazzi, but normal people will spot the holes in the arguments for it straight away.  No wonder no one wanted the E70 X5-Hybrid and E72 X6-Hybrid here.  I can't see this updated version being offered either, or if it is, not many takers.

Richard

[shadrack]

why cant they just do it the same as the lexus 400/450h (whatever its called) i was reading the mpg on one in a dealer last year when i was with someone collecting a new car and it was something like 45mpg combined despite it been a 4.? petrol.

other than that i totally agree with x5sport, i mean really where do they think electricitl comes from, i once had the opertunity to photo a nissan leaf with drax power station as the backdrop but did'nt, that would have proved my point

[Benstan]

Even using fossil fuels to generate electricity would result in half the co2 emissions from a fossil fuelled car. All averages of course. In the UK 25-30% of electricity comes from low carbon (nuclear and renewables) so only 75% of the electricity put into the car will be fossil fuelled. 

In some respects if you want to reduce the emissions and increase economy - you don't buy an x5 but a leaf or a polo blue motion - something small and light. But we all like big cars - some choose to reduce emissions and improve financials but converting to LPG for example - personally I don't see much difference with a hybrid and LPG convert.

Buying a hybrid is flawed but most  choices we make are. It would suit me to have one given my use of the car - appreciate that others will find flaws or conclude it doesn't suit them.

We will all have electric cars one day and our kids will be incredulous that we drove anything else

[shadrack]

Tbh in my situation now a 19 mile range would suit me for all week now and most weekends, the other flaw in the elctric cars is battery life against battery cost which will render most cars scrap after 5 years or so, and also the cost.

Tbh just last nite I was looking at polo blue motions for mrs shadrack and they have economy of urban 67 mpg, combimed of 80.7 mpg and extra urban of 91mpg, and even brand new they are half the cost of a leaf, also free tax, and the one I was looking at was 2 years old with only 10k miles and was less than 8k now that's economical, all the up sides none of the down sides, probly if calculated more economical when costs are taken into it, granted I also know\think that petrol\diesel cars will become a thing of the past but think the technology isn't up to it yet, we either need hydrogen or some sort of electric cars where the battery is smaller (say standard car battery size) so you can exchange batterys for long trips at a filling station or to have chargers that will charge in minutes rather than hours.

I also think I read somewhere that the national grid does not have the capacity sor us all to start buying electric cars.

[X5Sport]

Correct.  National Grid has a shortfall coming in the next few years due to coal stations being retired, not enough Gas stations being built and some nuclear plants at end of life with no replacements being available for around 20 years whilst all the public/planning enquiries go ahead.  BMW's new 'fast charge' system needs a 7.5kW (32A) installation for a three-hour charge (a new cooker point is the equivalent) or a 125A line for the DC rapid charge (30mins).  Household supplies are a standard 100A I think so you need two.

Some of the car manufacturers only 'rent' the battery to you so you get replacements as they reach end of life.  I read a while back that some of the packs can cost upwards of £11k - hence the leasing.  This leasing system has caused a problem with insurers as you own the car, but a 3rd party owns the battery.

Hydrogen fuel cells are probably the best bet, but the tech is too immature yet.

I wonder how many patents for new energy systems have been snapped up and buried by the oil companies?

[jaynana]

Compare 75mpg with my usual 19mpg!! Motorway yesterday was 33.6mpg..

I think electric is the way to go. Can't battery packs be hot swappable than having to charge for ages? 'Petrol stations' could swap battery packs just like us filling up today.

As for emissions of electricity generation - that needs sorting and it's easier than a few million emission generators running around.

I'd then also have a super duper sports car to go for a spin    >:D

[X5Sport]

[quote="jaynana"]
Can't battery packs be hot swappable than having to charge for ages? 'Petrol stations' could swap battery packs just like us filling up today.
[/quote]

Only if they were all standardised, which is something that may well have to come in the future.  You can recharge in as little as 30 mins.  Fuel/'Power Pack' stations aren't going to want lots of hazardous LiON batteries about because any fires caused by battery defects are nasty.

And then, would you want a Citroen supplied pack in your BMW?  You do want to actually get off the forecourt again right? )

Richard

[Benstan]

Capacity is an issue but if we recharge at night it's doable and we can then sell power to grid during the day (no different to having a solar pv panel and receiving a feed in tariff) when we aren't using the car - paid to work from home!!

[shadrack]

Batterys will also need to get small as some of them weigh around 200kgs at the min! Also I heard yesterday that LG make renaults batterys so a standard battery may not be a bad idea,

[Don Coffey]

I must say that I'm dissoppointed that they seem to be using a petrol engine.  Some years ago BMW were talking about a twin turbo 2 litre diesel hybrid.  I would also say that the 75 mpg is for those that live on the flat lands of Holland, not the real world.  That said I will follow the real world achievements with interest once released.

Don