Caravan: Generator., or no generator?

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 8:37 pm

One for all those that tow - not for a debate about the Do's and Dont's about towing.

We're looking at getting a 7-metre, twin-axle caravan and all of the options that go with that.

I think we're settled on a twin axle with something called a 4x4 electric mover for wrangling it off the tow ball.

Mrs X5Sport quite likes the idea of having aircon added before delivery and from what I can see, that means the potential need for a 2.6kW generator in order to avoid killing the leisure battery pronto!

I've used 'suitcase' gensets before but not with such a high output need, or on LPG, and I know they are noisy animals. I've also used trailer mounted gensets in the Army but they are a tad large - never mind painted a nasty green colour which so doesn't go with man pink! Suitcase gensets tend to have poor output waveforms so
I'm wary of them as not everything will put up with a +/-10% waveform distortion.

Weight wise I know a genset is no lightweight (around 45kgs) and needs to be installed close to the centre and low down so as not to mess up the handling. The a/c comes in at another 22kgs on the roof.

So the question is.....have any of you really found having a/c useful (even if the price is too high) and or needed and used a built in genset? If so what did you go with?

Finally can anyone tell me the actual continuos output of the X6 alternator? Mine has a factory fit tow system put on at build so the fan has been upgraded already.

Richard

Steamyrotter · Post by **Steamyrotter** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 9:20 pm

Richard

To be honest I think you'd be wasting your money on A/C. unless you are planning on many a foreign trip...
That coupled with the generator and mover (4 motors) awning and "essentials" will most probably take you over the MPTLW and well outside the 85% recommended ratio for caravan to towcar kerbweight...
Therefore leaving you with little or no user payload.
Add into the weight of the genny and you wil go horribly over your gross train weight rating of the X6 I would have thought..
There are not many tourers that have space designed in for a perm install generator (that i know of!)

On most pitches you will only get approx 10A rated hookup (they say 16 but rarely are as they derate them on larger sites to even out usage) that is 2.4kw to start with..

The genny you'd need would be noisy too which wouldn't go down too well with anyone near..

Not sure you'd get anything back on it on re-sale either!!

I have holidayed in mine in some pretty hot sun (for uk) and very rarely has it got unbearable inside. Judicious use of windows, roof lights and flyscreens, and the odd conveniently paced fan will sort most situations..

I am not going to mention to the Mrs that you are getting movers fitted...
She is of the mind that if you cant reverse it or park it on your pitch then you shouldn't be towing it...
(which is why she used to tow it for us.. lol)

As an aside, i was looking at the specs for an E70,and coupled with my caravan at 7.95m, the E70 X5 is technically too light for the 85% rule........(well guideline) It needs to be another 100kg heavier!!!

Oh btw.. If you really have to go for the mover option make sure you get the largest leisure battery that can fit in the locker.. The movers are prone to killing lesser batteries..

Don Coffey · Post by **Don Coffey** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 9:30 pm

Steamyrotter sums up my thoughts nicely. Really no need for the AC. If it's that hot then you shouldn't be inside a caravan all day anyway. I have never seen someone use a genny on site and would suggest that site owners might take the hump if it is noisy, possible even ask you to leave if you wont turn it off. Unless your looking at a custom made van, there just wouldn't be anywhere to put the genny except in the back of the X.

If AC is a must have, it might mean you have to consider the Motorhome option. Or indeed go on a couple of caravan forums to see if you find those that have AC and how they get on.

What van have you got your eye on?

Don

allforus · Post by **allforus** » Mon Sep 01, 2014 10:24 pm

I had AC on one of my first bailey caravans think I used it on elect on one evening while going to the up. For a couple of pints well turned into a session and got back to find the van that cold had to open alls I does to let heat in oops

They work very well but are a little noisy if only the vibration through the roof

I use a Honda 20 I for the current van and the one before had it for about 7 or 8 years runs microwave etc

As for the mover go for the best four wheel one you can find if you have too as the single ones on a twin are as good as useless on a twin axle

Hope this helps

kjb1 · Post by **kjb1** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 6:35 am

agreed, ac waste of money in my eyes and genny a massive no! I have an extractor fan in my compass which allows 3 settings of fan ferocity. The fan can be set to extract whilst cooking or to spin the other way to draw air in from the outside, as a fan. This on the lowest setting at night is fantastic at taking away that dead air of the caravan you sometimes wake up to on a stuffy night. Works a treat!

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:16 am

Thanks for the replies guys. It pretty much matches my thoughts, but I needed to know from experienced hands.

We should not exceed the GTW for the outfit but weight was an area I was particularly concerned about. I have first hand experience of getting the ratio wrong and it's not something I ever want to repeat!! I do want to stay the right side of the 85% recommended trailer/tractor combo ratio.

We're looking at a Bailey Unicorn 3 'Barcelona'. No idea if or when it might be bought as yet - I need to be back in work first too!! One of the Swift models, a Sterling Eccles 'Coral' is a second choice. Yet to see one in the flesh and it has a possibly more useful layout. Spent the last two weekends looking now and there are advantages/disadvantages with both. It's like buying a house!! Even what the thing is made of seems to cause differences. AluTech, GRP, bonded, screwed, plastic floor, wood floor.....the list goes on and I can't even compare apples with apples as they're all different. I guess we'll buy what feels right in the end.

The cost of a/c plus the genset was a lot!! And as pointed out we would never get that outlay back. Now a sat dish might be more useful....

Battery wise I was thinking of a 110Ah and fitting a CTEK MXS10 charger to keep it topped up when the hookup was available etc. I might even have a spare on standby for the 'mover' but again watching the weight very carefully.

The X6 has already had the corrected wiring installed by BMW under warranty.

I've towed heavy/large outfits before but not this long so we will avail ourselves if some refresher training, particularly for tother half as her largest 'tow' was a Laser sailing boat!!

Steamyrotter · Post by **Steamyrotter** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:14 pm

[quote="X5Sport"]
Battery wise I was thinking of a 110Ah and fitting a CTEK MXS10 charger to keep it topped up when the hookup was available etc. I might even have a spare on standby for the 'mover' but again watching the weight very carefully.
[/quote]

Modern caravan chargers are pretty good now so you shouldn't really need the CTEK on a hookup.
Winterising might be a good idea though.
It might be a problem trying to "separate" the 2 systems and they will probably fight for supremacy so to speak!!

I got a 40 solar panel for mine last year and (as long as I remember to turn the 12v system off!!) keeps the battery topped up nicely. I keep it in secure storage so no access to mains!!

Just like the car the thing to do is look around many dealers and manufacturers. There is invariably a layout that fits your bill..

I went to look for a cheap twin axle do-er upper and ended up buying the second most expensive one there as th layout was practically perfect for our wants....

Oh and just thought..
If your chosen van has the ALKO hitch stabiliser you must ensure you have an extended ALKO hitch (fixed) or ensure your detachable is 'certified' for use with the hitch stabiliser...
Reasons for this are the hitch stabiliser needs an extra 15-20mm clearance compared to "normal" hitches, and they exert strange loadings on the ball under use. It could invalidate your insurance and warranties..
(Have read a few horror stories about tow balls shearing off and people ripping bumpers off whilst being a bit enthusiastic....luckily not experienced, or seen it myself)

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:52 pm

BMW standard Westfalia swan neck. Every van I've seen has the ALKO stabiliser. I'll check to see what it's rated to, though no idea where to find that! What am I looking for in terms of numbers and/or clearances?

UPDATE: Found a plate on the towbar which says 'Coupling Type A50-X' which if I'm reading ALKO's notes correctly means it's the right type already(?). Clearance vertically is 90mm so again meeting the ALKO requirement of 65mm or more.

The Bailey's have a 100W solar panel (which will help). Will have to try to get to grips with how the 250V and 12V systems operate and what keeps them apart so to speak.

Still looking for a breakaway cable point too. That is definitely absent and as the electric connector doesn't swing down (as it did on my E53) there's no bolt to loop around. I'll need to ask Westfalia what their recommended way is.

Learning curve still steep!

Richard

allforus · Post by **allforus** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 3:56 pm

I invested in a lithium cell 100 amp equivalent to 200 amp lead acid but very expensive even when bought as a x demo

But it will last me a week without hook up and using tv etc so worth it for me

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 4:11 pm

That's something else to add into the mix.......

But then again, £700 a pop is

. And that's a lot of normal leisure batteries, never mind the fire risk if you get a dodgy one.

R

sid10 · Post by **sid10** » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:15 pm

hi the best advise is to look at as many caravan layouts as possible we got it wrong first time round , costly mistake we eventually bought a Elddis Superstorm twin axle after having a factory visit with a lounge either end it has a Rhino mover that just locks onto 2 wheels & is excellent compared with the truma on the last twin axle .
We just got back from the Lake district on Friday staying on the excellent Fallbarrow campsite along lake Windermere the pitches were tight but cars parked in front of their vans made it impossible to hitch the caravan on as the people had gone out for the day , this is when the mover comes into its own !
Wait until the end of the season for winter bargains if you can , check build quality aswell as caravan owner forums , awnings again important as we went for an Inaca Stella which is brilliant but we have a 390 for lesser breaks & a porch awning for weekends . Cant see the need for aircon as the windows & extractors are brilliant plus you can always sit in the car if too hot .
Goodluck with your search
ps if you want a log cabin on Fallbarrow instead they have a one for £850,000

CondorX5 · Post by **CondorX5** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:41 pm

Coming in on this a bit late, Richard, but nonetheless happy to share our experience as long term caravanners/motorhomers. We do carry a genny - its a Honda Silent Suitcase type, the i20 I think it is, has the inbuilt inverter so runs sensitive electronics without problems and really is quiet -you cannot hear it when in the van. We have a permanent aircon installed and could not do without it, but we both have health related issues meaning that the aircon is really important for us. It runs perfectly well on normal campsite hookups, or the genny.

I fitted some solar panels which keep our leisure batteries well charged, and our motorhome has an Electroblok which charges vehicle battery and leisure batteries and ensures there is no drain down of the vehicle battery. It switches automatically to mains power if plugged in.

Happy hunting for the right van - we eventually moved on to a motorhome from a caravan as it was just easier for us, but each have their merits.

X5Sport · Post by **X5Sport** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 10:12 pm

Thanks Condor. I would look at the 'silent' ones anyway. Air con is still in the frame too.

We're going to have a lookee see at the latest vans at the Caravan & Motorhome Show at the NEC in a couple of weeks so we can either pin down the 'one' or get totally confused.

Richard

Steamyrotter · Post by **Steamyrotter** » Fri Oct 03, 2014 11:47 pm

[quote="X5Sport"]
so we can either pin down the 'one' or get totally confused.
[/quote]

It'll be the latter........

allforus · Post by **allforus** » Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:18 am

I think all caravans are. Compromise think we have enjoyed every van we ever had all for different reasons like you say just take you're time at the nec and have a good look there are always deals to be so be ruthless

Good luck and happy hunting

Graeme

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